Quote from HetzersGonnaHetz on March 8, 2020, 9:39 pm

I've been out all night and only just got home to check this thread and reply, apologies for radio silence.

Before continuing I thought I should give a bit of background to this transaction. My friend, the mod, was involved in battlefield recovery and tours of the Narva front. A member of his group who'd got stuff still boxed up from a previous dig together asked if he could help him sell items from said previous dig. This transaction happened off of forums but just between me and him in normal discourse as we are friends outside of the forums. As my friend had got it off a friend of his to sell, he didn't think to check the decals details, I mistake yes, but an honest one. Once I contacted him today and mentioned people had found faults with the decal, he checked properly himself, he agreed, and has said if I want to return it for a full refund I can. This wasn't an impersonal transaction, and one that unfortunately included a few honest human mistakes, which have been proven as so by the quick reaction to the developments of the decal by my friend, and rectified.

He called his mate who had asked him for help selling first thing this morning, who said that he believed that it was found by the group they were out with, but due to the fact they were visiting estates and fairs in Estonia purchasing items it could have come from one of those. The original seller is just as surprised and miffed as me and my friend about the fact the decal isn't any good. No foul play by any sides in this.

I'd like to thank all contributors to this thread for helping identify the decal as repro, and for helping me to increase my knowledge on German helmet collecting.

For my own further knowledge, does this repro decal style match any others you have encountered on helmets previously?

Kindest Regards

Harvey

Quote from sysyphus on March 8, 2020, 11:14 pm

good to hear it ended well..  i still hope your friend didn't play the fool with you.

Decal of this kind is just one of many repro examples out there... this specific one i guess is one made not so long ago. Personally i don't remember have seen it before  but as said there are so many and i haven't saved all of them.

It resembles the "thin wing" Huber Jordan und Korner.

Quote from David C. on March 8, 2020, 11:23 pm

To me it resembles nothing. Just my opinion.

To be blunt, I have said it before. No need to study repro decals, that's a waste of time. Study originals...plenty to observe. Once confidence is established, you can just discount repro decals all together.

Thanks, D.

Quote from sysyphus on March 8, 2020, 11:51 pm

If i try to reply to our friend to a specific question he did, then i want to let him know that the characteristic of this fake are the vertical thin feathers of the wings, which are similar to that one that i mentioned.

Quote from David C. on March 9, 2020, 12:00 am

Hey Andrea

What I am trying to say is "Why bother" ? Repro decals date back to old Hollywood films from the 1940's. Many are quite pathetic. But that's 80 years of fake decals that were applied. To try & catalog 80 years of dozens of fakes...for what purpose ? If it's fake...discount it & move forward. Why study it ? That could bring confusion to a new collector.

It's just my take on it. If you are told a decal is fake...just ignore it & move on. Spend your time wisely studying originals...That's not a waste of time

Thanks, D.

Quote from sysyphus on March 9, 2020, 12:21 am

I agree 100% with you David. there is no need to bother trying to detect when a fake was made or how looks like.

I just followed to the letter the curiosity of our friend..lol

This also due to the fact that i was often asked by other lads when one or another fake has made his appereance into the "market"; this is pretty useless i concur but i guess it is a legit question nonetheless.. Some fake are seen into a specific time frame and never again, so i expect to see in the future even better made ones (since i guess the technology will allow this) as a matter of investigation in a double sense.

A

Quote from David C. on March 9, 2020, 12:29 am

Well...remember, it's not just the decal...it's the helmet involved, the application, the brown "frosty" lacquer lines, the convincing wear, these are tough to duplicate.

No worry on future tech printing methods. There are enough experienced collectors to validate originality. (Such as you)

Thanks, D

 

 

Quote from sysyphus on March 9, 2020, 12:52 am

Thanks God we have also other aspects and details to keep in mind and to observe as you said.. That's the funny and challenging part of this hobby.

However there will be a day that a perfect crime into militaria antiques might be committed? Who knows..? I am not meaning camos but specifically to decals applications?

Part of the classic art we do see is also reproduced...(paint and sculptures) they fooled many experts.

🙂

 

Quote from David C. on March 9, 2020, 1:45 am

A fun topic. Wish we could talk face to face.

I don't predict a problem. Most helmets, M35, 40's 42's. We know what is expected to be...as far as decals. Most helmets are already decaled that were brought home. What's left to mess with ? What examples will be faked ? A rear stamped Quist ? A late war, high lot # M42 that is post war decaled ? We will be suspicious. You need the helmets available with no decals to install a fake to. Really, think about it.

Anyway...just my opinion friend

Thanks, D